[00:00:01] Speaker A: Feeling stuck in your relationship. Like nothing's terribly wrong, but it's also not right. The sparks dulled, the days blur, and everything feels a bit like Groundhog Day. You guys are not alone. So many couples hit this place. And the worst part is it can feel helpless, hopeless, like this is just how things are now. But here's the truth. Good relationships aren't magic. They're not built on luck or chemistry alone. They're built on skills. And if no one ever taught you those skills, of course you're feeling stuck. How would you know the path forward? How would you know what to do to make a change?
In today's episode, we're circling back to the theme of our very first and still most popular episode. With a fresh look at how you can start shifting things using real learnable tools. Whether it's communication, connection, or just feeling like teammates again, change is possible. All you need are the right skills. Let's dive in.
People were always telling us, you guys are such a team. And we began to realise this just isn't the case for most couples.
[00:01:13] Speaker B: But we knew from our own experience of turning our relationship into a team that change isn't just possible, it's inevitable. All you need is a little direction.
[00:01:21] Speaker A: So that's what we do on this show. We steer you in the right direction. We keep it simple. We show you why relationship struggles show up and how you can start changing your relationship today.
[00:01:31] Speaker B: And we bring the good stuff by turning information from leading relationship experts and evidence based research into easy to understand skills and tools that anyone can use.
[00:01:40] Speaker A: We also share insights from our own 23 years of experience together. And we chat with some incredible couples who offer their wisdom on relationships.
[00:01:48] Speaker B: If a better relationship is what you want, then get comfy. Whatever tickles your pickle. As we prepare to dive into all.
[00:01:54] Speaker A: Things team, we're Kim and Rog and this is the Living the Team Life podcast.
[00:02:04] Speaker B: So this is episode 101 of the Living the team life podcast.
And in the sort of celebration stage of our the last Fortnights episode, our 100th episode, Kim and I were talking a lot about our journey on the podcast and we remembered that our very first podcast, and actually still one of our most popular, was called is your relationship stuck?
And the truth is, many people do feel that way. So when we were doing our research and we wanted to start with a bang and start with something that really hit home with people, that feeling of being stuck, of helplessness, where you don't know if you don't think you've got a way forward in your relationship. We know that's very pertinent for people. It's something that a lot of people feel.
You know, the feedback we get from friends, the feedback we get from listeners is this is something that, you know, could really affect them in their relationship.
[00:03:02] Speaker A: Big issue if it's pertinent.
[00:03:05] Speaker B: That's my word for the day.
Thank you, babe.
[00:03:12] Speaker A: Never use that.
[00:03:14] Speaker B: Well, let's not get stuck on it.
Um, we're always learning and improving, but, you know, this. This pertinent topic, something Kim and I feel very strongly about, you know, because we believe you do deserve a really. A really strong and great relationship. You don't need to feel.
You don't need to feel like you're being pulled along by life. We want people to feel like you have control of your life. So it's just not another Groundhog Day.
You deserve the relationship that you really want, and we believe that you don't have to be stuck. There is another way.
[00:03:50] Speaker A: Yeah, the stuck thing.
Even after almost three years of doing this podcast, it really is the thing that I think we feel, or one of the things we feel most passionately about, is the fact that people just.
They're stuck in the sense that they don't know the path forward.
[00:04:10] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:04:11] Speaker A: And it's so heartbreaking because we know there is a path forward and that it's not that complicated.
And I think.
I think what we want for people to take out of today one thing, if they only take one thing out of today, it's that there absolutely is a way forward. And it really was one of the reasons we started the podcast was knowing that there is a path forward and that it's not magic, that it's not that hard to find that path, but the information isn't easily available for people in a way that is. Is simple. So we found that path forward in the relationship when things were hard, when things got stuck, when life had been mulling along for many years in a certain rhythm, and it's not what you wanted anymore. We found how to get out of that rut, how to get unstuck. But that took us a long time, and. And. And it took a lot of work and a lot of heavy work, and. And we realized the path forward doesn't need to be that complicated. And it can be a simple path forward. And at the crux of that simple path forward is the understanding that relationships are just built on skills. Relationships are simply built on learning the skills and the tools that make relationships work.
And to learn those Skills and tools isn't that hard if you have a simple.
A simple method for learning them. And I think as soon as couples understand that it's not their fault, there's no perfect person out there, that all they need to do to make change in their relationship legitimately, the only thing they need to do is start learning the new skills and put the work in that they will very quickly be. Start to see a shift back towards becoming a team, back towards feeling that sense of love and connection that they used to have. And. And that's what we're here talking about today, is how to show you the path forward, what that path looks like based on learning the skills to help you get unstuck in your relationship.
[00:06:26] Speaker B: And that's right, babe. Because couples are looking for a path forward. So when we say, you know, couples are feeling stuck in their relationship, we're not saying like, oh, they want out. They mean more like stuck in life. Like, I don't know how to move forward. And it's not like something's terribly wrong or, you know, it's more that things just aren't right and they need.
It's like they're on a boat and they're drifting through the river of life, and they don't have a paddle, so they're not actually providing.
Providing the push, providing the power to move forward, the currents pulling them along. And so they've got a lack of control. They're not even sure where they're going. They're still moving without a rudder, without a paddle. But that lack of agency, that lack of control can feel, again, very helpless.
And that's why you feel stuck, especially in this life and times getting away from you. You know, when this happens, people have these thoughts of, like, is this just how it is now?
I keep hoping things are going to change, but I just don't know how to make the change.
I love my partner, but we're just not growing.
I feel like we're just going through the motions or the big one. We don't feel like teammates anymore. We feel more like roommates.
[00:07:43] Speaker A: Yeah.
It comes with thoughts, for sure. Being stuck.
There's some of them that people sort of express.
Also comes with some pretty deep feelings.
So you can end up in your feelings. That's more, I guess, a more solitary space because our feelings are so personal and they make us feel so vulnerable. And some of the feelings can be really unsettling. Things like a sense of.
Of feeling powerless, of defeated, that there is no other way to do this, of. Of feeling numb in life, like, almost disengaged from day to day life because you can't see a path forward. And what you do know is that you want things to change, but you don't know how. That's the stuckness. I feel stuck, and I'm stuck because I don't have a path forward. We're never really stuck if we have a path forward. We might feel somewhere we want something to change, but we don't feel the stuckness. The stuckness is. I don't know how to get out of this.
You know, people feel often when this. In. In this sense of stuckness, they can start to feel really disconnected from their partner.
People can start to feel feelings even of grief for the relationship that they once had, that. That no longer feels like it exists there. Grief for the fact that the future they expected to have with their partner is not what's coming to life.
And. And that sort of leads to that sense of hopelessness, of.
Of almost resignation that this is just what I have to accept. I don't have any other path forward.
[00:09:28] Speaker B: Yeah. So. And if you've been sitting in this space for a while with those thoughts and feelings, it's okay. You're not alone. Again, one of the reasons it was our first episode was because we knew this is something that is very common.
But there is a consequence for not making change, for saying, staying stuck in your relationship.
Because you do find that emotional distance over time will start to grow when you're not growing together.
Because the proof is most couples don't fall apart in one big moment. It happens slowly over time that. That drift. When you're not growing together, you're growing apart. And funnily enough, the research tells us that couples often will wait up to six years after a problem starts, or they start to feel that stuckness before they actually get help. And in many cases, it's too late. But we don't want to be there. We don't. That's not what we want. That's not what this podcast is about.
But when things don't change, the resentment can also build. You know, unspoken needs start piling up. And if it's not both of you pulling away, it might just be one of you pulling away. And then maybe if one pulls away, the other push harder. But either the result is, again, that hopelessness, that alone feeling.
And when you have that hopelessness, you stop actually bringing things up. You stop actually wanting to work on it. And people listen to this podcast because I want a better relationship, and they see hope, but I Think if you let things go on too long, if you don't make that change, then that's when hopelessness creeps in and hope starts to fade.
And you start telling yourself, well, maybe this is just what a long term relationship is.
[00:11:02] Speaker A: Yeah, it doesn't have to be that way, you guys. It really doesn't. It's not your fault that you've ended up in this space. We know you guys want a better relationship. You guys tell us that that's one of the things we get messaged and that you're willing to put in the work because you're here right now. That's why you're listening to this podcast. You want more. You want to get unstuck, you want to make a change.
But the reality is, most of you, just like us, were never even taught that relationships are just built on skills. They weren't. We weren't even taught that mindset that relationships are just built on skills, let alone taught the actual skills that make relationships work.
So if you didn't have that modeled to you and it wasn't taught in school, which it definitely wasn't, we end up doing the best that we can and often just hoping things get better on their own.
But I think the truth of life is if you don't find a path forward, if nothing changes, nothing changes, things will not get better on their own. You have to go out there and find the way forward. And if you're thinking that right now, hey, I want to do something about this, that's exactly what you should be thinking, because there is a path forward.
There is a way out of this for you to make a change in your relationship, the change that you want to make. And it's not even that complicated.
It's really just about learning those skills, literally. We're not talking about fluffy ideas and big, complicated models of things. We're talking about real research, informed tools built on the wisdom of the world's top relationship experts. People like the Gottmans, Stan Tatkin, Terry Real, Esther Perel, Sue Johnson, Brene Brown. All of these people have informed the tools that we teach here on the podcast. And these guys have spent decades studying what actually works in relationships and what doesn't. And we have now spent years simplifying this research and adding our own experience to provide you guys learnable, step by step relationship tools that are built for real people, real couples, just like you, just like us. And we know these tools work because we use them ourselves. They help us get unstuck, they help us grow. They, sorry, they helped us to get unstuck, They've helped us to grow. They're what we teach now. We use these tools still every single day because relationships are not a one and done thing. They're a grow continuously. Life puts pressure on you. Your relationship is the space that has to hold that. And the more you practice these skills, the easier it gets to do this. But the reality is you are always leaning on these skills to help get you through, and that's exactly what they do.
[00:13:52] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think, babe, we've refined how we use these skills and tools over time because we actually put them into practice when we have disagreements, when we dream together.
We use these in our day to day and they really direct the course of our relationship. And I know the better we get at them, the better our relationship gets.
[00:14:15] Speaker A: Well, I think what happened was we sort of uncovered a lot of these skills 10 years ago, 10 plus years ago, 13 years ago now, when we were at this stuck point and we wanted to make a change and we did the work and it took us years of work and we worked out what important skills we needed to learn and we went and learned them. But then starting the podcast three years ago and working out a way to make these skills really accessible for anybody has leveled up how we implement them in our relationship.
[00:14:48] Speaker B: Yeah. Especially for, like blokes, because I know that, you know, you're very emotionally literate and I feel like I've got a high eq. But this, I think a lot of women will get this emotional stuff, will get this, you know, that that's. That is more natural for them. While some guys, that it's not as natural and it wasn't always that natural for me.
But I think, you know, you and I, can we do this in a way that we hope is accessible to blokes and is not to. What do they say? Woo woo? Is that what they say?
[00:15:20] Speaker A: Oh, I love the woo woo.
[00:15:22] Speaker B: Well, now I do too. So.
[00:15:25] Speaker A: All right, I've got a quote for you, Rog.
It's from Esther Perel and I really love this quote and I'm interested to hear through the lens of what we're talking about today, which is that if you're stuck in your relationship, there is a path forward. It's simply understanding that relationship skills can be learned and there is information available out there to learn them. Simply, we've created it.
The thing Esther Perel says is the quality of our relationships determines the quality of our lives.
What do you think about that?
[00:16:03] Speaker B: Oh, this is powerful, isn't it, and you know, she, with that accent of her, she, everything she says just seems like a war drop mic moment. So I, I, you know, we're big fans of Esther Perel, but this is powerful because I, I do believe the, you know, I've heard people say who you choose as your partner is the most important decision you'll make in your life.
But working on your relationship is the most important investment you'll make in your life. Oh, I like that mic drop Roger.
And you know, the, the, the, the science says this as well.
They did this study at Harvard and actually said that the quality of our relationships is the best predictor of our health from 50 to 80 years old than our cholesterol levels. And if you look at all the science of marketing behind the butters, the margarines and everything, and people trying to reduce the cholesterol, when maybe it's more important to work on your relationship, your.
[00:17:04] Speaker A: Romantic relationship will impact your health between the ages of 50 and 80. Is the first time I'm hearing this more than your cholesterol levels.
[00:17:15] Speaker B: Yeah, but being stuck in an unfulfilling relationship, that's wild.
You have sleep issues, chronic stress, lower immune function, increased rates of anxiety, increased rates of depression. All this is science backed and so no wonder it has such an impact on your, on your actual physical, long term health. And that's just the clinical stuff, babe. You know, what about the effects of, you know, our relationship on who we are as people and how much joy we get out of life? You know, the big stuff, the feeling safe, feeling strong, feeling like you have somewhere to rest your head, somewhere to rest your soul at the end of the day, you know, at the end of the week, at the end of a month or year when life gets tough so you've got somewhere to reset, recharge and face the world tomorrow.
[00:17:59] Speaker A: That stat is just crazy. I actually, I mean it proves what we're doing is, is important, which is super cool.
[00:18:10] Speaker B: Well, it's not just your mental health, it's your physical health. And putting in that, we know, we put so much work in going to the gym, doing yoga, you know, all these other things to reduce stress, all these longevity studies. When the truth is people in relationships, in strong relationships last, have longer lives than people who are in relationships that really struggle.
[00:18:29] Speaker A: We gotta add this to our repertoire because we talk a lot about getting the most out of life and having a big life. And something really important to us in our mission statement was the intergenerational impact of a positive relationship. So first and Foremost for the couple to themselves and the type of life they can have and secondly for the children and what type of life and cycle having a great relationship has in your parents relationship. But we very rarely talk about the individual health benefits from a clinical standpoint and that is really powerful.
[00:19:01] Speaker B: Yeah, forget about the ice bath, guys. You should be having a bubble bath with your partner.
[00:19:04] Speaker A: Oh, we could do some fun little pictures of that or something of us.
[00:19:08] Speaker B: In the bubble bath. I don't think people want to see that on social. Maybe they do. I don't know, maybe you, not me.
[00:19:14] Speaker A: I'm blown away by that. That's amazing. Okay, so let's talk about these tools a little bit further because I can imagine that some of you listening will be thinking, okay, we get the point. The, we get the point. We've banged on about it. The tools and the skills that you learn for your relationship and then work to implement in your relationship are the most important thing to help your relationship grow. And I think what you said Rog about, it's such an important point. People always say the most important thing you can choose in your life is your partner.
You said the art. The most important investment you can make is working on your relationship. I would, I would dare to say that's more important than the partner you pick. You can't get bogged down in trying to find the perfect person because everybody relationship will take work 100%.
[00:20:02] Speaker B: We're all different people. Like it doesn't matter. Like you're two people who are very different, who have different dreams, hopes, goals, aspirations, different backgrounds. And you're coming together to make a better life together. And that takes time, that takes skills.
[00:20:17] Speaker A: With all the pressures of life on.
[00:20:18] Speaker B: Top of that, 100%.
[00:20:19] Speaker A: So changes that happen throughout and just.
[00:20:22] Speaker B: The pressure of having a great relationship. Well, you can have a great relationship. You just need to work on it.
[00:20:28] Speaker A: So if that investment is the most important investment you ever make, which is into your relationship, what are some of the skills and tools you'd be learning and how would they impact your relationship? That's what I imagine our audience is thinking right now. Come on guys, give us some juice so that we can actually see this in action.
So let's run through a few of the key skills and tools that we actually teach you guys. You guys will have heard, because you're following along, that we are launching our six week online relationship course, the Relationship Playbook.
The waitlist is already open.
You can find that everywhere we are and we will be teaching these specific skills and tools in Detail. So we're going to give you a high level overview now. But this is what we unpack in detail in a really simple, everyday way inside the course. The course is, is very practical. We've got a ton of activities in there and it's very much about being able to adapt these skills and adopt these skills instantly. So once you learn it, you can put it into play that day. It's that it's that simple. And because you get to practice it, you're already really putting it into play. Anyway. Let's start. The first relationship tool that we will just highlight for you guys is called the five to one ratio. And this comes from the Gottmans.
[00:21:45] Speaker B: Yeah, we've talked about on this podcast. It is one of the most significant tools you can put into your relationship.
[00:21:51] Speaker A: And it's a great example of how powerful tools can be. So this tool is a tool that, that basically states that healthy relationships maintain a ratio of at least five positive interactions for every one negative interaction that you have. So what that means is.
Well, you can find out about that in the course.
But what Gottman found, and he really of. The Gottmans are really the leaders in relationship research. They found this ratio to be the tipping point between a happy and an unhappy couple. So if you met this ratio of five positive interactions to one negative interaction, you would be tipped towards more likely being happy than unhappy. And this was in long term studies.
So positive interactions, just to give you a little clue what they look like, it's affection, humor, small acts of kindness, kindness, bits of connection, they buffer against the negativity and they build emotional resilience in the relationship.
And the research said the, the research the Gottmans did said that after observing 3 thousands of couples in there. So they actually have a love lab. Love lab where they actually video and watch and observe these.
[00:23:02] Speaker B: They even use AI to track, to track movements in body language and stuff. Now it's pretty, pretty intense.
[00:23:08] Speaker A: The Gottmans were able to predict divorce with over 90% accuracy using this tool and a few other markers. So this tool is such a strong predictor of whether you will stay married to your partner that they were able to predict divorce with over 90% accurate accuracy.
Why is this tool learnable or how is this tool learnable? And, and what will we teach you in the course?
Once you understand what counts as a positive interaction and how to spot the patterns in your own interactions with your partner, in the dynamic you have with your partner, this becomes a really simple habit that you build into your day.
All right. The second tool we just want to touch on is soft startups.
[00:23:57] Speaker B: Yeah. So a soft startup, if you can imagine, is you go to your partner because you want to tell them something, maybe something's wrong, and you go in hard.
And you know what? When that happens, 96% of the time, the outcome of that conversation, you ended a fight.
So when we start a conversation, especially hard ones, you can go and going, you never do this. Instead of, I feel that we need that.
And there's a big difference into how those feel. And the science tells us there's a big difference in how those will create an outcome for that conversation, for the relationship.
[00:24:36] Speaker A: Yeah, that one's a great one. And understanding the nuance and learning how to recognize what your typical openers are and how to just simply reframe them in the moment, which is, again, something we teach in the course, becomes a powerful shift that really, anyone can do. You really start very quickly once you learn about this tool to notice, oh, I do start conversations a little bit hard.
[00:25:02] Speaker B: I do. Why. Why did that. Why did we end up in a fight then? Oh, wait a second. It's because I went in hard.
[00:25:08] Speaker A: I went in hard.
[00:25:09] Speaker B: And so as a result, the other person got defensive, or we just, you know, if. When you have a fight, generally you need an outcome where you both go, okay, yep, I get it. You know, we take accountability, we repair and move on.
But if you come in hard, then the other person straight away is, well, this. This is unfair. And it's more likely, in fact, it's 96% likely to end in an outcome that is not good for the relationship.
[00:25:35] Speaker A: All right, the third tool we're going to outline today is the relationship cycle tool. So this is understanding that relationships have a cycle so that we flow through the states of harmony, disharmony and repair. And Terry Real talks about this, and Esther Perel talks about this, this particular relationship tool. And what this tool is designed to do is actually help couples to understand that no relationship is free of conflict. And I've spoken about the fact that I get so antsy at these ridiculous famous couples who love to come on shows and say, I'm so proud because I've never fought. It's just unrealistic. And the reality is it's not healthy. I mean, if you listen to Esther Perel talk this, she's pretty passionate about how ridiculous that sort of comment is. Because disharmony is part of living with each other's emotions and differences and disagreements, but also differences of opinion.
[00:26:28] Speaker B: Yeah. Hakuta matata it's the circle of relationship life.
[00:26:37] Speaker A: So understanding that disharmony is normal also really helps couples to stop catastrophizing. Catastrophizing. When they get into those states of disharmony. Because once you understand the cycle exists, you can pull out the shame piece where you're like, oh, we're fighting again. Yep, you're fighting again. And that is a totally normal part of being in a relationship.
[00:26:55] Speaker B: Yeah. Because if we do the right thing, if we learn the right skills, we'll get from disharmony to repair, and then we'll get from repair back into harmony again.
[00:27:03] Speaker A: Yeah. And research tells us on this one that repair is in fact, the number one predictor of long term relationship success. How we repair in our relationship is so very important.
And if we understand this phase, these three phases of the relationship, which is that we cycle through and that we will be in disharmony at different points, it takes a lot of the anger out of the repair, a lot of the frustration out of the repair, and you can repair better, which is going to be a predictor for long term success in your relationship. So what do you learn or what do you need to learn to be able to do this? You need to be able to recognize where you're at in the cycle and learn how to respond to where you're at instead of reacting. So, okay, I see what is happening here. I see what state we're in. What is the best way to respond to that? And obviously we teach that within the relationship playbook as well.
[00:27:59] Speaker B: Yeah. So those are three examples, babe, of that. With the right tools and with a bit of guidance, you can really shift your relationship. You can shift it so there's more connection. You can shift it so there's more emotional intimacy. And by doing this, you'll have more fun together. And again, if this has sparked anything for you, we do go deeper into each of these on our new course, the online course, the Relationship Playbook. And it launches in only a few weeks on August 27th.
[00:28:25] Speaker A: You can sign up now for the wait list. We've got heaps of people. We really do.
[00:28:28] Speaker B: Yeah, we've already got hundreds of people on the wait list. We're super excited.
So. So pop your name on the wait
[email protected] or you could just head to our socials or one of the links in the. Wherever you listen to your podcast, you're amazing. You've just spent quality time on your relationship.
[00:28:48] Speaker A: Feel like you're on a roll. If you want more living the team life, relationship insights and conversations. Head over to kim and rog.com where you can find all the show notes as well as tons of other relationship goodies.
[00:28:59] Speaker B: And if you like today's episode, please hit subscribe or let another couple know where they can find us. It'll make them happy, and it'll make us really happy.
[00:29:07] Speaker A: Until next time, keep on living the team life.
