Episode Transcript
[00:00:02] Speaker A: Have you ever dreamed of building your own sustainable home? You know, like one off? The design shows a home that looks and feels amazing to live in, all whilst delivering you the dream life of never having to pay another utility bill. It sounds out of reach, right? Building is complicated, expensive, daunting. Well, the couple we're chatting with today are smashing that idea. The old fashioned notion that the everyday Aussie can't get seriously involved in making sure their house has good, sustainable design. And not just that they're arming people with enough information to make these builds affordable. That's right, affordable, beautiful, sustainable homes. It doesn't get much better. They are trailblazers and this conversation will knock your socks off as you think of all the possibilities. So get comfy in whatever tickles you. Pickle. As we dive in with Lisa and boots.
Hey, we're Kim and Rog and we're here to show couples how to get the best out of their relationship so they can start living their dream life together.
[00:01:01] Speaker B: We're a West Aussie couple who are living the life of our dreams. We don't entertain the word should, we think about the future as a field of possibilities and we let joy be our compass.
[00:01:09] Speaker A: We've taken the simple idea of working as a team and applied it to our marriage and it's been a game changer, allowing us to work out what truly lights us up in life and to go after it together.
[00:01:18] Speaker B: From living in snowy Japan to starting our own house flipping business, we've achieved some big dreams and most importantly, we feel fulfilled and are having the most fun we've ever had.
[00:01:26] Speaker A: Pick conversations from inspiring couples, thoughts from relationship experts and tales from our own lives as we help you to gain the wisdom and skills you'll need to turn your relationship into a real team.
[00:01:36] Speaker B: These are relationship conversations for real people, by real people. So sit back, get comfy in whatever tickles you pickle and enjoy living the team life.
So, boots, if you. If Lisa was a superhero and what would be her superhero name and what would be her superhero powers?
[00:02:04] Speaker C: A superhero name.
Captain spreadsheet.
[00:02:11] Speaker B: I love that.
[00:02:13] Speaker D: Brilliant.
[00:02:14] Speaker C: Superpower is organization.
[00:02:17] Speaker B: I like it. I like it.
[00:02:18] Speaker A: Elisa, what about boots? What's his superpower and his superhero name?
[00:02:27] Speaker D: Captain Reliable.
[00:02:30] Speaker A: That's a good one.
[00:02:31] Speaker D: And his superpower is being unflappable and steady and sure and reliable.
[00:02:41] Speaker A: Do you know, it's a really. That's a beautiful. Both of them are beautiful. Obviously, spreadsheeting's magic, especially in my opinion, but especially the reliability is an interesting one because there's a lot of research around what women actually find most attractive in men and what gets the good chemicals flowing for them in their body. So the bonding chemicals and men following through is one of those things.
There you go. Reliability is absolutely one of the things that attracts us to a partner and bonds us to them.
[00:03:16] Speaker D: Yeah. And that steadiness I think, which is the yin and yang, you know, I'm much more emotional so, you know, what goes up must come down and all those kind of things. So whereas boots is kind of always that steady, reliable person in this family which keeps things on a nice even keel.
[00:03:40] Speaker A: I totally hear you. I think that's, we, we reflect a similar sort of vibe in there.
[00:03:45] Speaker B: I say it like um, Kim's like short waves and I'm more like the long wave, you know, so.
[00:03:51] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, and those short waves can get shorter and shorter depending on where we're at in the week.
Yeah, yeah, we got, I got some roses today and um, and then we had a little disagreement and he pointed to the roses and he said, I thought these would last longer.
[00:04:11] Speaker D: Well the truth bomb with Valentine's Day is we have let that slip for quite a while. And our daughter Jetta, who is twelve tomorrow, said to us last night or the night before, she said, you two really need to do something about this, this is not, you know, so anyway, we both just rushed in five minutes before this podcast and was literally shit going everywhere around this place. And he like hands me a big of flowers and I was like, oh, they're natives, they're, oh gosh, that's just, you know me so well and I gave him a little gift too, and then we came screaming in here. So that's our, that's for us.
[00:04:52] Speaker A: Well you guys are amazing because I didn't give Rog anything, so I thought we'd agreed it was a, it was a no no thing day. But Rog does know I love a surprise. That is one of my favorites.
[00:05:05] Speaker B: So I'd gone through a few years of not giving Kim anything and so it was a buildup. So it was all planned.
[00:05:12] Speaker A: That's right.
[00:05:14] Speaker D: Those roses are going to last at least 24 hours.
[00:05:18] Speaker B: Well it was about four physically.
[00:05:21] Speaker A: They pay off a little less apparently.
So you guys are actually known for. I just need to talk a little bit about your incredible, sustainable, low cost home, book and house. And obviously the amazing business you have built, book and blend that teaches other everyday people, not just Aussies, but people around the world, it seems, about the sustainable design principles behind book and house. And we do really want to dig into this, because this is just absolutely so inspiring for us. But before we do that, can you guys just give us a little bit of background on how you guys actually met?
[00:06:02] Speaker D: Do I take this?
[00:06:03] Speaker C: You can take this. Yeah, sure.
[00:06:04] Speaker D: Okay. So we've known each other since high school, but we went to different high schools.
But let's just say quite a lot of my friends were getting to know his friends really, really well, but we didn't get to know each other like that. We were both in other relationships through those years, and we both went off. I went off to university and found my first husband, which makes it sound like I like to trade them in all the time, but I promise I've stopped at two.
So, you know, I met my husband and we got married, and life just went separate ways. Boots went on to marry his girlfriend that he had, you know, late teens and everything. And Brits had one child with his wife, and I had two small children with my husband.
And then kind of very unknowingly, I separated from my husband. And probably a year or two later, you separated from your wife? And I remember my mum saying to me in the kitchen one day, she was doing the dishes, and she said, remember your old mate, boots?
I heard he's separated from his wife. And my heart just literally broke for him because, like, a. I knew the pain of something and the shame associated with something. You know, I'm pretty a type personality. I like to succeed at everything type thing, and I effed up the most important thing, decision, you know, in my whole life type thing. And it was really difficult time. And I just thought everything I knew about boots, he was just, you know, a mate, but I knew he was such a beautiful, kind soul inside and out. And I just could feel that pain for him, and I just didn't do anything really about it. And then a mutual friend who. This story gets a little bit juicy because my boyfriend at the time, back in our high school years, who's still a very dear friend of mine, was actually. He's actually one of boots best mates. And so this is years later, we're both separated from our partners, and he had a party down in Melbourne and he invited us to come down to this party. We both lived kind of up in northern Victoria. And he said, why don't you pick up boots, like, in the car so you can just carpool basically to Melbourne? And I was like, oh, yeah, sure. And reached out to boots and said, do you want me to pick you up? And said, yes. And basically I picked him up.
[00:08:51] Speaker C: Probably the quickest trip to Melbourne we've ever had. Just chat, chat, chat, chat.
[00:08:55] Speaker D: Yeah. And I reckon halfway to Melbourne, it was on.
I don't mean on is in.
[00:09:01] Speaker B: Pull the car over.
[00:09:05] Speaker D: But we just. There was something. There was just something there that was just so easy and stunning, so comfortable and. Yeah, we did hook up that weekend at the party. And we have basically been inseparable ever since in that it was later in life for both of us. I had a four year old and a three year old and you had a two year old. So we both kind of went into it with if at some point we really don't think this is right, there was. Then we're out. It was just. It was. We were way past the bullshit by that stage. There was no games, no mucking around. And it was. It just. I don't know, it just progressed so kind of effortlessly as far as our relationship is concerned now, blending two families and starting a new life together and stuff like that. None of that is effortless, of course, but our relationship was effortless. Do you agree?
[00:10:03] Speaker C: Yeah.
We have spoken about it a few times over the years that if probably the fortunate thing for us because we both had kids, then it was, as Liz said, you sort of cut through all the crap, you know, neither of us were there to play games or anything like that. You know, it wasn't just us. It was, you know, was our kids as well.
[00:10:26] Speaker A: So stakes are higher, right?
[00:10:29] Speaker C: Yeah. Well, that's what we felt. And for both of us, it just felt right. Anyway, so.
[00:10:33] Speaker A: Yeah, it's so beautiful. And I. It's just crazy. I wish I could go back and. Do I have a counseling degree? I did a thesis because it was a master's degree. And I wish I could go back and actually study the specific moment that couples meet when they have a really successful outcome. Because it is very clear to us that there is a pattern emerging. And the exact same words get said every time. One. We just couldn't stop talking. We felt safe with this person. We knew it was on straight away. And always, we haven't separated since we've been. It's just been inseparable. Inseparable is always. It's so interesting that these themes come up. And Rog and I have been talking about this particularly from the safety perspective, what that means to people. We've actually just recorded an episode on soul mates. And whether that actually is people just talking about feeling really safe. What you recognize in someone that will protect your soul and sees your essence and this ability to be your true self so quickly, which is what I feel like I'm hearing from you guys as well. This capacity to just be yourselves and feel safe in that space straight away.
[00:11:46] Speaker C: Yeah, that's certainly what it felt like. And so, I don't know, there wasn't any, I suppose, actual deciding on it as such. But, you know, certainly, as I said, like, having kids involved. So I don't know whether that played a part in it, a big part in it, or no part in it, I don't know. But probably deep down, the kids, you know, definitely have played a part in that. That, as I say, that, yeah, it was just, yeah, I don't know, nice and easy.
[00:12:17] Speaker D: And we sometimes, not often, but sometimes go, I wonder why the universe, it didn't happen or click or whatever. When we were in high school, we weren't great friends or anything like that, but we were friends, and we just. I didn't. I never even thought about it because I had a partner and he had a partner, but the universe knows best. And if we didn't go down this path or if we had have kind of gotten on then and hooked up and we're together from that point, would our lives even look the same? Did we have to learn the lessons that we learned over those? Really, it's the toughest thing that both of us have ever been through is, you know, our divorces and, you know, it's soul destroying, and we're different people now because of those experiences. And perhaps that was all part of the puzzle. And the second part of that is our family, our four children wouldn't look the way it does now if we had hooked up then. And we would never, ever change that in a million years. So it is how it is meant to be.
[00:13:30] Speaker B: So Kim loves to talk about the universe as well, Lisa, so we'll be out the front, and if something really good happens or really bad happens, she'll just go, it's just the universe telling us, Roger. And I'm like, well, no, it's the fact you've been working really hard on what we've been doing and you've made a conscious decision and you've done all that, like, what you guys doing in your personal lives, in your professional lives, your business isn't an accident.
Yes, maybe there was that. Why. Why did. Why was that party at that stage and you just decided to give him a lift and your mum sang it, and you. That spark, maybe that. Maybe that is the. The universe, but every step from there for me is like, no. Like, there was something you, you both wanted to cut through the bullshit. You had aligned values. Uh, you, you've worked really hard together. So, yeah, I just wanted to say.
[00:14:17] Speaker A: That because I would love to know on the values part. Yeah, because you guys obviously built a business around sustainability, and that's a very strong value for people in that space. And a growing value for more people, hopefully.
Did you talk about sustainability at the beginning? Was that something that.
[00:14:39] Speaker B: Did you talk about that on the car ride?
[00:14:42] Speaker C: No.
[00:14:46] Speaker D: This evolution around us working in this space has been such an organic, natural process. We sure as hell did not sit down and talk about, well, I believe strongly in sustainability and all those kind of things, but it is how we both just chose or choose to live our lives.
Our value systems are really quite closely aligned, as far as, you know. How much do we really need?
It just was a natural progression, is all I can say. And when we started talking about, I think the first time where certainly sustainable homes or building came into play was when we renovated our very first little farmhouse we bought together. So we bought this little house, what was it? Twelve squares?
[00:15:45] Speaker C: Twelve or 13 squares. An old weatherboard place.
[00:15:48] Speaker D: Yeah, it was a beautiful old farmhouse. Verandas all the way around, like wisteria vine around like, it was just beautiful, but it was tiny and we had already had three kids at that point. And we were like, okay, let's extend the house.
And I know now that when boots and I are working on a project together, that that's when we were at our best. We are just formidable. When we put, when we're on the same page, working towards the same goal, we are just formidable.
[00:16:24] Speaker C: And I think part of that too is, I suppose deep down knowing each other's strength and weaknesses, that we know what, obviously we're capable of ourselves. And there's things that I can't do to save myself, at least does it without even blinking, you know, and vice versa. So. And I think for us, that's what we've probably found. It's worked well, really.
[00:16:51] Speaker D: Yeah.
Those values around sustainability and not taking more than we need and those kind of things is. And about looking after the planet, I think comes from more of a place where we both grew up as country kids. We grew up, we both grew up with very simple values in our families. We had what we needed. Needed, but probably no extra.
We both, our holidays growing up as kids, we both, it's kind of funny, would spend our holidays up at the river, you know, in a tent or a caravan with our, with our families and, and we didn't do the, you know, trips to the Gold coast or overseas or anything like that. We spent a lot of time in nature. That's where boots is kind of happiness. That's where I'm happiest. So that deep respect for nature and how happy it can make you and how it's connected to your wellbeing and everything was not something we talked about, it just was. And so when we went to, we went to extend and renovate this beautiful old farmhouse that we bought. It was on eleven acres and, you know, we had the pony for the kids and we put in a pool and those kind of things.
I was working, I'd been working for quite a long time already with my science background around kind of environmental and sustainability type projects in my work, but they were more kind of community focused and around other things like home energy efficiency and things like that. So I was learning about all that at work, and then I would come home and I'd be all excited and I'd be saying to boots, let's do this and let's build it that way. And he was always, always really interested and on board. And I always say we're a terrible team because there's not a sane one between us. So when one of us goes, let's, you know, let's not just, I don't know, build an extension on the house. Let's make it all passively designed and, you know, all this kind of stuff, boots goes, right? Oh, that sounds great.
So the answer is a no. We did not sit down and go, what are your values around sustainability? It was just very organic. Very much so.
[00:19:12] Speaker A: I guess, in essence, our values come through in who we are, in our conversations anyway. Don't they, like you? Project them out into the way you engage in the world, the way you engage with each other from the get go and even going onwards. I really love what you spoke about, obviously, with the formidable team Lisa. But then you boots, describing that ability to support one another and that yin and yang and have respect for one another's strengths and weaknesses, that's a really important part of a relationship, I think, and it's what builds an incredible team, because the reality is we are going to have weaknesses. And I think it's something that people get caught up in, in a relationship, focusing on the negative parts, sometimes the failings of their partner, and missing the opportunity to see the incredible strengths their partner brings, and also the opportunity for them to rise up and support that person, because we come as imperfect people and there's a misconception out there that we should, and a general cultural idea that we should be perfect before we reach a relationship. People say, fix yourself first or find yourself first. And we just don't ascribe to that here. We believe when you find an incredible partner, they will help you be your best self. And that's okay in a relationship that's absolutely great, that's working together as a team. And I think what you described with the having, bringing each other's strengths and then the word formidable, it's like you take the best from each of you, and not just the best. You give each other support for the bits you are maybe not so great at or missing. And that's what creates this. This impenetrable strength in the team.
[00:20:55] Speaker C: Yeah, that's what we feel.
[00:20:57] Speaker D: And I feel like, though, that you. What you said is so true. And that's probably why I said when we're working on that common goal and that we're really formidable, it's when you guys contacted us and said, we'd love you to be on the podcast, our initial reaction when I said to Peetz, oh, my gosh, we're both like. We were both like, no, no, no. We can't do that. We are not the perfect couple. We have no idea what we're doing, and we fight and we, you know, we're so far from imperfect. There's so many things I'd love to continue to work on in our relationship and everything, but the thing that really does rise to the top is that, yeah, when we pull together, it's just. It really is quite amazing.
And we probably just always need to keep kind of revisiting that and going back and continually finding ways to pull together because, yeah, it's when we're in the weeds of something, in a project or a job, and that may be things to do with, like, a challenge with one of the kids or, you know, developing the business or building and renovating one of our three homes, we've done. And, you know, those kind of things when we're. Yeah, when we're rowing together. Watch out.
[00:22:20] Speaker A: So I love that. And also, I think what you say there, Lisa, another thing that we really believe in, which is we should be upskilling in our relationships. So that's the foundation of what we're teaching here, is that relationships are just skill based. So, as you say, they're not perfect and they're never meant to be. This idea that you're going to find a perfect person, it's just irrational. Humans are imperfect by their very nature. And so when you put two imperfect humans together, you're going to get an abundance of imperfection. But if you work on your skills together, that's all it is, skill, learning. And you continuously have this open willingness to grow as a couple. And I think what I really took out of that is the fact that you can say that, you know, in front of one another, say, there's lots of things I'd like to work on in this relationship. It's not a jab at the relationship. It's saying, I respect this relationship so much that I want to keep making it even better. Is that how you receive that? When she says that, boots, does it feel like that for you?
[00:23:18] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure. It's just a constant. I think any relationship is a constant learning and evolving.
You don't walk into a relationship, meet that person, and then everything's the same for the rest of your lives. There's always different challenges, things that are always gonna test us, you know, whether it's work, whether it's family, kids, anything. You know, there's different things that will certainly challenge and different times. And, you know, you might be just in the mundane of just doing day to day things, you know, day in, day out, and then the challenge presents itself, and sometimes it might be the small things, as we know, and things can blow up, and you think, well, hang on. It shouldn't really blow up. It's not really a major thing or a big deal, but we kind of make it into big things. And sometimes it takes, you know, that other person say, okay, maybe we need to look at this in a different way and put things into perspective. And so, yeah, very much.
[00:24:20] Speaker D: But relationships are really hard work. It doesn't matter if the relationship is your husband, your child, your friend, if you want the. The most out of, you know, if you want a healthy, loving relationship with somebody, anybody, even a colleague, it's hard work. You get back what you put in. And we notice when we do get in those ruts and it goes a while where we haven't put effort into the relationship. And by this, I don't mean going out on hot date nights and things like that, because that's a lot. That's 15 years ago. I think they stopped.
But I mean that when things get hard, really trying to come back together and connect again, find that connection again and put in the hard work. And we both know pretty quickly when we're not putting in the hard work, don't we?
[00:25:11] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure.
[00:25:11] Speaker D: Like, you feel that disconnect and, you know, you kind of. You just kind of start looking, going looking for it. It's like, righto, righto. It's time to put, you know, have some deep conversations, do some things together. And a lot of the time, for us, it is a project. You know, you often find when we want to connect, we'll kind of create a project together that we can just be together or just, you know, even little tiny things. Like, I might need to go to the nursery to get some plants at the minute. And I was like, was that this morning? I said, want to come for a drive to the nursery? You know, I don't need him at the nursery.
[00:25:53] Speaker A: But you want him there.
[00:25:55] Speaker D: Yeah, it's like, oh, it's about a 20 minutes drive, so we can have some hot time together in the car or not hot. That was fun.
[00:26:03] Speaker A: You guys are cars.
[00:26:07] Speaker D: We have a big no.
[00:26:11] Speaker B: No. But I love that because so much, you know, when people see a problem in their relationship, they often think, oh, we need to go out for a romantic dinner, or we need to go for a trip to Italy or organize something big and grand. But sometimes it's just doing a job together, spending time together, relating on something that has nothing to do with the relationship, just talking and realizing, wait a second, we're on the same team, we're on the same page. We just haven't had the chance to sit down and talk as, you know, best friends, as life partners. We just haven't given ourselves the time because everyone's so. Oops. Everyone's so busy. Right. I forget sometimes this is a podcast, and so I use all these body motions, gesticulator, but, you know, boots. It is. It is the mundane sometimes that is more important than the grand gestures.
[00:27:02] Speaker C: Very true. Yeah, agree.
It's those, as you say, the mundane. Just the day in, day out where you probably need to be working your hardest on your relationship. Because obviously, when you're on holidays, things like that, things are grand. They're amazing. You know, if it's a bit of a no brainer, you know, you're not working too hard on your relationship at that particular time. As you say, it's the day in, day out, the mundane stuff. You know, they're getting the kids to school. What's fatigue tonight? All that sort of stuff is where, you know, you can really, I suppose, as far as the team goes, you know, work it out. And, you know, that can be for us at times where it's, I don't know, the testing times. I close. As far as, you know, where your relationships at you know, if it's something as simple as what's the tea tonight? And we're looking at each other, well, I haven't organized.
[00:27:56] Speaker B: I thought you were doing it, you know.
[00:27:57] Speaker C: Yeah, well, I've been busy and, well, being busy, too, you know, it shouldn't be like that.
[00:28:02] Speaker A: So it is one of those things, though, isn't it? What you're describing really is around, you know, a holiday. And it's such a great analogy. You've given a holiday. There's no stress. There's nothing outside of the joy of the holiday. You can say, what's for tea tonight? And you just say, well, which restaurant do you want to pick? It's real easy. But day to day, what's for tea tonight? And you hear, I didn't notice that you were busy all day. I expected you to do this. It's like all the stresses of life are in the background to the relationship as well. And that's where focusing on those little things, and as you guys say, connecting in little ways can be so powerful because you're learning to cope with all the stressors and still find space in that to work together. And I love what you said about the project bringing you together, because we talk a lot about here, finding a shared purpose with your partner and being very purposeful in life. It's the other half of what we teach. So we teach people how to become a team with an ultimate focus of following your dreams, because we firmly believe, and it's been proven in our own relationship in the last decade, 22 years together. But the first decade, we were not so good at this. We were very young once we discovered what our purpose was together, once we started dreaming together, all those little falls to the side, those little conflicts, those struggles, they didn't seem so big anymore because we were focused on something together that, that really lit us up and really got us excited. And like you guys say, we become formidable when we're focused on something because we absolutely know there's, like, there's no alternative that will be achieved. And so you spur one another on together, and you stay focused on that bigger dream. And I think projects are an amazing, amazing way to do that for couples. And on that, I would love to know how you got from your first little house project across. I'm going to segue across to your big book and house project, which is the home that you now use basically as a model for thousands of other couples and families from around the world to be able to build their own project, manage, design, build their own sustainable home and have an impact on the world that way. So tell me about how you guys got to book in house.
[00:30:23] Speaker D: Well, we were living in our beautiful, what I would have called our forever home. That's the little farmhouse that we'd renovated. We got married there. We had our fourth child there, Jetta.
It really was our home. But the longer we lived in that house for, and it had these two distinct halves. It had the old, you know, weatherboard farm house half that we did do all the right things with, and ninja late and all those kind of things. And then we had this other half of the house, which was all passively designed to work with nature, had no very little requirements for heating and cooling. It was, you know, and we lived in that house and just could never believe the difference it felt to live in the two halves of the house. It was just mind blowing, was like the ultimate science experiment. And the longer we were there, we just kept saying, imagine if we could do a whole house like this.
You just imagine. And again, not a sensible one between us. So, you know, then boots, like, we're terrible, because boots is always like, yeah, we can, let's do that. And I'm like, oh, okay. So we went, right, oh, let's start thinking about this process of designing a whole house passively and also off grid was also very high on our list at that point.
The issue became, when we jumped into that, it was very. I suppose they would say we were pioneering it in a sense. Not people have been doing it forever, but we wanted to do it in a very mainstream type of way, a, we wanted to do it on the same budget that it would cost to build it. Just an everyday, you know, project builder metric on home or something. We wanted, because we thought, if we can't do it on the same budget, it's not worth doing. We stay where we are.
And so we kind of set ourselves these limits or these challenges. And what I discovered, even though I already had quite a good knowledge base from my work, what I actually discovered was there's a massive information gap out there for people who are interested in building and living this way. It was, I mean, you got to imagine this is probably ten years ago when I started designing the house, and it was so frustrating. I didn't know who to trust. You pay professionals and you've got no, you know, you're paying them thousands of dollars and you've got no guarantees of what you're going to get out. The other. There was no examples. There was. I just. It was. It was two years really, of trawling information, reading books, you know, all that kind of stuff, until we actually came up with the design of this house that I felt was perfect for us. And at the time, friends and family kind of started saying to us, we started the build process, and they were saying to us, what are you doing? Tell us. Show us how you're doing it type thing. And I discovered this app called Instagram, and I love photos. I'm like a photo nerd. And I also like words, too. I like. I love telling a story. And so it was a natural thing just to jump on Instagram and start sharing just pics of the house. But it was meant for our friends and family.
[00:33:54] Speaker C: Initially, it was just sort of just to document it almost for our own purpose.
[00:33:58] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:33:58] Speaker C: You know, just as an album, you know, to look back on, you know, in the future.
[00:34:03] Speaker A: And so you guys truly were organic. I mean, people use that word a lot, but this is really legitimately organic. You just wanted to share pictures. That's beautiful.
[00:34:14] Speaker D: Hell, yeah. We had no idea what we were doing. I still don't, by the way.
Yeah, I started sharing it, and people started just jumping on board. And then this went on for years while we built the house and everything. And I was finding myself answering people's questions, like, all day and all night long. And so the teacher. I was a teacher for eight years and one of my careers over the years. So I love education. And so straight away, I thought, just to keep myself sane, I'll put all this information that I'm sharing, you know, messaging people and everything into some resources. And my son is a software engineer.
Software engineer. At the time, he was just in high school, but he's got that brain, and he helped me knock up a really simple little website. People could go to the website and, you know, they'd message me, and I say, right, there's a. Go. Download the document on thermal mass. And I was even at the time giving away our house plans to people because I just wanted to spread the word. Yes. I was just like. I wanted to help everybody. I was like, by this stage, we were living in the house, and I was like, oh, my God, everybody needs to know what it is like to live in a house that is designed like this. Why does not everybody live like this?
[00:35:41] Speaker B: So, yeah, I feel like you're breaking a social norm in some respects, because Kim and I feel that it's a bit of a social norm for us to say we're proud of our relationship and we work as a team and you don't put the individual first, you put the team first. But for you, you're saying you can build a character house that's passive and low cost, off the grid, and you can do it on a good budget and anyone can do it. Because when I. You used to think about passive designs, you know, solar design, and I'm definitely not a designer. I was like, oh, it must be modern, it must be expensive. Right. And it's years and years before you get that payback. But you're saying that's. That's not the case, right?
[00:36:22] Speaker A: 100% massive norm?
[00:36:24] Speaker C: No, that's right. It's definitely not the case, necessarily. And our place to look at would. Would you call modern? Very clean lines. And I suppose it's not what we would call cluttered. I suppose. So from that point of view, you would say, yes, it's modern, but you could do the exact same design, but in more of a traditional facade as such with it. But the house would actually function from a sustainability or passively designed point of view, exactly the same. So you could do it on a smaller scale, you could do it on a bigger scale. You're not limited to, obviously, what we've built physically here. And things anywhere in the world can.
[00:37:11] Speaker D: Be built using these principles.
[00:37:13] Speaker C: Yeah, that's right. Yeah.
[00:37:14] Speaker B: But people are wanting your house specifically. So are people coming and actually building your exact house on their land?
[00:37:21] Speaker D: Yes.
It got a bit weird because we were helping people basically access that information that I couldn't find back in the day. So all I was doing was creating resources that just didn't exist, that I couldn't find. It was just. There was a problem, there was a gap, and I was just filling it as best I could. But what happens is people start to learn about it, and then they start to go, this is amazing. Why is not every single human on the planet building this way? I mean, you end up with a house with no bills, it's comfortable all year round. It's you connected to the outdoors. There's this incredible sense of well being in a home that's filled with beautiful natural light and connected to outside. And there's, you know, and then that feeling of how proud you feel about there's no impact in the planet, or there is very little impact on the planet from how we choose to live in this house. So there's all these wonderful things, and people were going, okay, why can't. This is great. Let's all do this. But then they were like, we just want to build your house. As you know, we've learned about it all. Now we appreciate it. Can we just build your house? And that at this point in time, still, there was still no business.
It became a business nearly two years, a bit over two years ago. Up to that point, it was just us trying to help people fill that information gap.
[00:38:57] Speaker A: It's such a generous way that you've evolved into this space. And it's, I feel like in some way the universe or karma has brought about what you deserve in this because you have given generously. The reality is, you know, the fact that people say, I just want to build your house, the barriers to building are high. They make it. It's a big decision. It's a lot of money. People have very busy lives and they find it really, really difficult. And one of the things I love about what you guys are doing and what you've done is you've just taken away the. And I don't want to use them, say excuses, but they are excuses. The excuses people had not to try and build passive solar homes, not to try and make a big difference. And like Rog said, traditionally, there's very much a perception out there that a well designed passive solar home is going to be too expensive and you have to wait. And that's true of most environmental products. People say, yeah, it's payback over time, but the fact that you've managed to come to a space where you are saying no, if you're smart about this and you know how to do, it's just information. If you know how to do this, you guys can do it at the same price of a house that's going to cost you a fortune over the next 20 years to live in. So it's removing those barriers. And I can see why people wanted to just replicate your own house, because we make excuses in life or we find things too difficult and so we don't do them. And so you guys have really taken it to the absolute level because you do actually sell your house plans right now.
[00:40:35] Speaker D: Yeah, we do. Although it's not something we were doing for much longer.
The reason being is the thing that gets me out of bed every day with this business is that we just want to do everything we can do to speed up the world's transition to low impact homes. So when I think about what's the next thing I should do in this business, I just think about the thing that will get us to that goal faster. How can we get this information into people's hands faster? Now, in my view, our home is one home, and it's been designed very specifically for our climate zone. It's been designed in my aesthetic, all those kind of things. And it's. And it is quite, you know, a long house, so often it requires a bit more land, you know, those kind of things. So for me, I think it's much more important that we make sure that people just get the information so they feel empowered throughout their own design process, their own unique creation of a home, so that they just have that information just enough to make them dangerous, you know, so that when they rock into a building designer's office, an architect, or they roll into the project home, you know, the display homes out in the suburbs or whatever, if they have enough information up there that they know what to ask for, you know, where to put the windows, how to orientate the house, where to put the thermal mass, where to put the cross ventilation, all of which cost not a cent extra than putting it all in the wrong spot.
[00:42:18] Speaker A: Yes.
[00:42:19] Speaker D: If they are armed and dangerous, then that change will occur very quickly out there in the universe, you know, and worldwide, hopefully. So for me, I would actually. I feel like our house is the Trojan horse. You know, it's like people love it, which still floors me because it's quite unique. It's very much my taste and everything like that. And it's eight years old now. You know, people would be thinking about remodeling who follow current trends and all those kind of things, whereas, you know, ours is still, you know, people love it on the gram and. But what I want is just to help people access the information to follow their own dream. And that's why the workshops that we run are so much more valuable, in my opinion, than, say, buying our house plans. But that's a process of, first of all, people understanding that they need the information. People don't think they need the information. They think that they're going to rock into a professional's office and the professional just look after them. And it's.
It's proven over and over and over and over again that that is not the case. You need to know what to ask for or you're in strife.
[00:43:38] Speaker C: Yeah, I suppose touching on that, too. Like, literally going back to our old farmhouse that we did renovate, we literally lost thousands and thousands of dollars because we took some, what we thought were pretty good designs and things that we.
[00:43:53] Speaker D: Ideas. Yep.
[00:43:55] Speaker C: Took them to this designer that we'd heard good things about and said, we've got an idea. This is what we want to do as far as renovating the house.
We really want to try and do this passively. And he says, yep, I hear what you're saying.
So went away, he dropped these house plans and gave us a call to say, I've got them ready, come over, let's sit down, go through them and have a look. And we sat down, and it was nothing like what we'd asked for. There was nothing passive about it. It was orientated wrong, and we just sort of felt like either he hadn't listened or he didn't have the information. So it was unsure, but gave us something that looked fantastic. Aesthetically, it looked beautiful, but it just wasn't what we were looking for as far as the sustainability and passively designed thing. So we literally said, thank you, but no thank you, and we literally threw them in the bin and it was thousands of dollars, you know, so that's when it was probably a switch, I suppose, for you, and said, don't worry about it, I'll do it. I'll do it myself, you know. And probably from then on is where it sort of evolved to, I feel was a bit of a pivotal moment, is where it's we are now here.
[00:45:13] Speaker A: I mean, what you guys are describing is, is yourselves as huge disruptors in an industry. That's the truth of it. This is disrupting the building industry as we know it, because you want to empower people with. This is one of those very big industries that has a monster power imbalance because 99.9% of the population don't have a building background.
[00:45:35] Speaker B: But everyone's going to buy homes.
[00:45:37] Speaker A: They're going to build a house, right, or buy a home at some point. And so. And so we depend, like when we go to the doctor, we depend on that person with the power position to do the right thing by us. So I just think this is just so brilliant, what you're describing, disrupting this huge industry that is stuck in the past. Let's be honest, they don't design the way that they could be designing for where we're at in the world, and they don't want to because it makes life harder and it costs more and all the rest of it in their mind. But as you're saying, it doesn't have to. If they just want to tweak things around and refocus, how do you empower a couple? So say they can't, they don't have your plans anymore as an option, which is great, because I completely agree. Every house should be unique to the land, which I'm sure is something you press upon in your course. How do you empower them to understand how to get their needs across. Or even in that situation when they saw someone, do you go down to the detail of explaining how they could vet a planner or a designer or an architect at some point?
[00:46:43] Speaker D: Yep. There's a whole module in the workshop that tackles that, about what to look for and some questions to ask that will kind of shake out the, you know, separate the wood from the trees and.
But I think you're absolutely correct in that the building industry, I say, is the same as the wedding industry. So the second you say wedding, the cost of that party just tripled. Even though it's the same in the building industry, as soon as you say sustainable or passively designed or something, the cost just tripled. And there is absolutely no need to do that. And that's partly the empowering process, is teaching people that you can build any house out of any materials, any within reason, but certainly materials of the average normal build that's being built down the road. Yeah.
Using these principles. And I think when they complete the workshop, and look, we began doing them in person here at the house and we are running another workshop here at the house in the next two weeks. But we can't do them that much anymore, but we just kind of can't keep up. So we have filmed it all and it's now available online with some Q and a sessions with me over Zoom throughout the process so I can give feedback on their individual projects and stuff. But by doing the workshop, they have the right amount of information that they can walk into, like into a designers or a builders premises and know that they're not necessarily saying, can you? I don't need that top shelf, sustainable, niche product that you have up and over there.
Because straight away, and look, this is not dissing incredible, perfectly designed, sustainable homes. We need those to be leading the way out on the cutting edge, looking at interesting materials and new technology to put in the incredible, awesome, right, we need that. But my take is that if we are going to move sustainable homes out of this niche place into the mainstream and make it accessible for everyday mum and dads, we are targeting people like us. A very average, boring mamas and papas with 2.2 kids. Right? That's us. We're nothing special. We could do it because we just simply had a little bit of information under our belt. And if, you know, we can empower them to have that same information under their belt so that they're not feeling they need to walk in there and ask for that really pricey, fancy looking, you know, spaceship looking house. It's just an average everyday house. And it takes a lot of that, those extra price tags out of it. Yeah.
[00:49:49] Speaker C: Because it can be very overwhelming, as you say, that 99% of the population aren't builders. And yet, as you say, we walk into either a real estate agent or a builders. You know, we want what we would all consider, you know, we're looking for a home. We want it to be our perfect home.
So you go to these experts, you know, to get the information and say, we're assuming that they're giving us all the correct information of what we need to know. But sometimes, you know, they're like, with any industry, I suppose, that you feel like they're just sort of. Yes, people. You know that. Yes, yes, we can do that. Yes, of course we can. We've got the perfect house for you. And, you know, you go down a rabbit hole, that's either a, it's too expensive for you or it's nothing, what you were looking for. So.
And that's what, you know, I suppose, is trying to, as you say, trying to give people as much information as we can just have enough information. So when they do walk into either a real estate agent or designers or whoever it may be, that they've got enough information to say, actually, I don't think that is what I'm looking for. You know, maybe something else.
You don't have to have all the knowledge, but just some of the knowledge.
[00:50:59] Speaker A: Just enough to be dangerous. I love that. I am taking that. That is just a brilliant saying, you know, and I think that's the truth of information in life. The more we give people, the more dangerous they can be and disrupt whatever is happening out there, because we're big believers. One of our pillars in our brand is that we don't believe in social norms. A lot of them do a lot of damage. We just ascribe to these ideas that the building companies know best, or whatever it is, you know, that relationships, you got to fix yourself first. They're just ideas that have been carried on over and over because nobody's had other information to be able to challenge them. But if people get out there and give them this information, all of a sudden people are like, oh, it's not that. It's not that hard and it's not that scary and we can get after it. And something I was thinking about as you guys were talking was another one of those things. The barriers that people might put up for themselves would be that undertaking the lead, or even just undertaking a build, can be quite stressful on a relationship. But I'm curious, when you give them the additional information, when they come to you and they get upskilled and empowered through the workshop, do you see relationships thrive then through the building process, do you see them have a positive outcome? Which would be, I would say, I mean, I worked as a property developer, obviously I developed land, but I experienced the purchases of the land and their stress through building a lot. And it was generally pretty catastrophic on relationships and households, the stress of building. So I was curious whether empowering them and giving this information reversed that and actually made the building process for couples potentially even a positive experience.
[00:52:44] Speaker D: Yeah, absolutely. Without a doubt. Now, I'm going to preface that by saying the building process is still bloody stressful. It is really hard, right. But I would say one of the number one things I hear a feedback from our workshop in particular, and even to some extent, our design packs, which are the smaller packs, which just give people just even some information about this house. But what I hear the most is I got on the same page as my partner. Like, the first thing I say at the start of the workshop, be it the online one or in person, is upfront. You really need to have your partner here because hearing the same information is just so valuable, you cannot even put a price on it. And what happens is, particularly in the first module, take people through their why? So they have to drill down.
Why the hell do I want to do this to myself? Why do I want to build this home? What does this mean for our family? What do we really need? And it's quite a lengthy process.
And then we work through over the rest of the modules, building on that to we actually, at the end, they actually walk away with a full design brief to take two builders, designers and those kind of things. So it's not just the learning, it's walking away with concrete resources. Now, when they work through that first module, a change happens pretty much instantly. And it's, it's incredible, just the amount of people who come back and say we were floundering around, even sometimes for years and years as a couple, trying to reach agreement on what we wanted, how we wanted to do it, where we wanted to do it. And all of a sudden they're instantly, because they just stepped through a really simple process of discovering what's. They do it separately first, and then they do it together. And so everyone, you know, then they prioritize their list of wants and needs and whys, and it just removes a whole heap of that angst between the partnership and they can just get on with the really hard work of building a really great house.
[00:55:08] Speaker A: The other thing is that you said there that I just think so great is it's the what that they go around in circles on for years. Because what is not a direction? What is just a something that could be a something else. Why is a direction. And that's why it makes such a difference when you teach them to find their why. Because the what could be anything, what materials, what type of house, where it is, you're not going to know till you look at lots of different things. But if you know where you're going, then you'll be able to figure out what will fit on the path to get to where you're going. And the answers just almost appear before you when you have.
[00:55:44] Speaker B: Straightens you up, doesn't it?
[00:55:46] Speaker C: It does, yeah, you're exactly right. And I think what you, you just said then with, you get bogged down into, you know, say for example, a couple of, he might want four bedrooms and she wants three bedrooms, but I want white walls, but I want the cream, the white, the off white, the ivory or the bay.
And, you know, as you say, you get bogged down into the aesthetics of things and don't worry about that. As you say, if you get the why, first of, okay, take how many rooms we want and is it going to be brick? Is it going to be timber? Take that out of it and get onto the why are we doing this? So then that immediately what we feel is sort of brings people together, get them on the same page and go, yep, okay, this is why we're doing this. You know, it might be, we want to do the right thing for the planet. We might want to do it for financial reasons. You know, we don't want to have any bills going forward for the next, you know, forever. So there could be a whole different reason of why they're doing it. So once you sort of determine the why, then, as you say, the rest of it is for, then, then you bunker down into, do we want three bedrooms or do we want four bedrooms? What colors are going to be? The rest of that seems to happen fairly organically then, but it happens together rather than people with their own ideas and try to say, no, this is what I want. It says.
[00:57:09] Speaker B: So you're helping people build beautiful, sustainable houses, you're saving marriages, it sounds like, as well.
But what about the final product once it's done? What is it about a sustainable home that you've had a hand in building or the person's who are built, who are wanting this home, are building themselves. What is it about that that impacts their quality of life going forward? Like, why should you, why should you go for a sustainable house?
[00:57:41] Speaker D: So I'm just, I'm going to cut straight to wellbeing. And that's because there is actually a whole, I'm going to be a science nerd on you again. And. But there's a whole lot of research out there now around the impact on things like green spaces and how much natural light you have around you and all those kind of things that it's proven that it impacts your wellbeing and you spend so much time in your home. And if we break away from the science for a second, it's actually more about when I walk in the front door here, I walk into our big open plan living space and I immediately, the only way I can describe it is just exhale. Like I just feel everything relax. The space is comfortable. It's warm in winter. And this all happens by itself, just simply because of where you put the windows and those kind of things. It's warm in winter, it's cool in summer. There is natural light bouncing around everywhere. There's a connection. I can look out, I can see the sky, I can see the trees. And you can do this again anywhere.
And it really is this sense of everything's okay, you know, it's all good. And then it goes further than that in that we do have no bills and we do also, we wanted to raise our kids, our four children in a certain way. And we did want them to develop, you know, those values that we share around leaving the planet in better shape for the generations to come. And we never see, sat down with the kids and said, right, kids, we must recycle. We must, you know, all these kind of things. It's never been, you know, over to, you know, conversation like that. They just live like this. This is how they live. And they now go off and they're all starting to talk about, you know, buying homes and those kind of things now. And it's all coming through in the next generation. And there's this sense of pride there where if the ripple effect was only to our children and their children, and they are going to be able to experience what it feels like to live in a home that has been designed like this, then, well, it's why we did it in the first place. There was no such thing as book and blend in the first place. This was our why it was how we wanted to raise our kids.
[01:00:29] Speaker A: It's so good. It's part of our why in business is obviously to teach couples how to live better lives. So become a team and follow their dreams and have purpose. Because we just couldn't understand why people weren't pursuing their dreams like you. This was organic. People kept saying to us, you guys are such a team, especially after our daughter's diagnosis and we had to move home from Japan. And they were, you know, it's that, that purpose that we have has always been something that we've wanted to share. But beyond that, we actually want to impact children in homes by their parents having better relationships. And again, it's not that overtness. It goes to the identity of the home, the identity of the world that they live in. And so these young people grow up, whether it's in our case, with healthy relationships around them. And so that becomes their identity and their norm. Healthy relationships and what they look like and teamwork and all those sorts of things. Or in your case, they grow up in a home that is sustainable and environmentally considerate and aware of nature and aware of how the weather works and all these sorts of things, but not so overtly that they have to think about it in their own lives. It's part of who they are. It becomes part of their identity, and that'll pass on more easily and more easily again, because it becomes so embedded. It becomes, you know, I mean, what you're describing is evolution. You're evolving the species so that the next generation functions more easily in this way and again and again. It's just awesome.
[01:02:00] Speaker C: Yeah. We feel, I suppose, very humbled by probably in particular initially with our elder son bodie. When he went down to Melbourne to university and was trying to find an apartment in Melbourne. He was the one who was ringing us, telling us he's found an apartment, you know. Cause it's facing the right way, you know, and it's like 18 year old who's, you know, telling us that, you know, stuff that he's looking for, you know, which is just little things. Obviously, he's not designing a house, he's not building a house, but he's just trying to find the right apartment for him. That just helps, I suppose, encompass, you know, what he's grown up in and what, you know, we're trying to teach people and things is.
[01:02:42] Speaker D: And he will say it makes him quite unhappy to be in a dark, stuffy, uncomfortable because especially when you have to be in an apartment in the middle of Melbourne when you've grown up on a, like a little farm like ours. But he says he lives really comfortably and happily in his apartment that's all light and bright and facing the right way and got great, you know, got great cost ventilation and all that kind of stuff. So I love seeing these principles that I do go around touting that you can, you know, use in any house. You can even find an apartment that, you know, is designed actually by accident, but designed quite well and impact your.
[01:03:21] Speaker A: Quality of life entirely, which is just, you know, that's he's, he's describing having a happier life. As you say, that's going to impact everything he does, his mental wellbeing, but also his ability to focus and study and, you know, drive himself forward in whatever direction he wants to go. It's. That's a really, that's a really cool thing, and I'm sure a very proud moment for you guys to see that coming.
[01:03:45] Speaker C: Absolutely.
[01:03:45] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:03:46] Speaker D: Yeah.
[01:03:46] Speaker B: So we've got a picture of book and house up on our wall in a study because we're big vision boarders, stalkers, you know, Kim loves it. And so whenever we're feeling a bit down, we sort of picture our sort of future farmhouse, you know, and we look up for that and it's one of the pictures up there. But what's next on your vision board? What's next for book and blend well.
[01:04:10] Speaker D: For the business, which is just growing and we just get surprised every day, I think.
Again, like I said before, it's whatever we think is going to speed up this information transfer the fastest. That's what we're going to do.
So I do have a book that I would like to publish because I do think that could be a way of getting quite a large amount of information into people's hands quite easily.
And there's lots of other little ideas and projects going on at the moment. And I think once I work out which one will speed up that information transfer the quickest, we'll jump on that. But right now, it's been, we have spent two years literally chasing our tail. It is, we're just trying to keep up and meet demand and learn to do things like run a completely online business and things where, you know, we both have some experience, you know, a little bit of experience in business historically, but this, I mean, this is a whole new ballgame. And P's being influencers, apparently, is what people, people like us these days is so ridiculous that that's even something that's even in our vocab. But all of that is just such a learning process. And I really feel like we're only coming up for air now, and it's a nice time to just have a reset and go. Okay, what is next?
[01:05:53] Speaker C: Yeah, and it's even look at last year for us, we traveled fairly extensively last year around Australia and things, which initially we'd been planning that trip for quite some time for us. All our ducks lined up to travel last year, you know, that our three older kids had finished high school and were then, you know, obviously old enough and independent. And our youngest daughter, Jed, was in grade six, so we felt it was the right time if we were going to travel, that it was going to be easy enough to travel with her and be able to homeschool her. So, which was all fantastic. And then the closer it got, then we left on that trip early last year, and then the trip wasn't overtaken. That's the wrong term to use, but the trip almost became a bit of a working holiday as well for us. You know, that people were getting in contact with us, you know, in different, I'll say, states that we were in and, you know, saying, oh, you know, I've got these friends, they've built a house or they're building a house. You guys should really catch up with these guys. So we. We ended up doing that. Yeah, a dozen times, I suppose. You know, during the course of last year, while we were traveling, meeting people, and they were inviting us into their homes, whether the home was finished, there were some houses that were literally partway through. You know, these people were showing us through their house and that they sort of followed you on boot camp blend, and, you know, parts of them had been inspired by that. So they were really quite interested to show us through. And we sort of ended up photographing their house and then sort of giving a bit of their story as to their why and how they came about, you know, their journey and things, which was. Yeah, it's really quite flattering. You know, when people get in contact with you and they want to show you, you know, what they're doing, you know, whether they've been inspired by us or someone else, you know, it's. It's really heartwarming.
[01:07:51] Speaker D: Trailblazers just on that. We were stuck in a caravan together for almost a year. If you really want to test your relationship, Pete, go and. Go and do that.
[01:08:03] Speaker A: That is. It's not a large amount of space when the shit hits the fan, is it?
[01:08:10] Speaker C: Not a lot of space?
[01:08:12] Speaker D: No. No. I figure if we can do that, we can do pretty much anything formidable.
[01:08:18] Speaker A: You to do anything. And I just.
I just love what you say as well, Lisa, on what's next? And you said reset. I just think enough couples don't realize that, like everything, when, when we're growing and moving in life, we have to have periods of reset and foundation. We can't just keep trying to move. And that that is a priority. And that is part of growing as well, is just building that foundation, solidifying wherever you are at and giving yourself that time to reset, recollect all those sorts of things, and then get going again on whatever, as you say, you're going to pick to keep ramping up this incredible mission and inspiring purpose that you both have. So we just. That was just epic. I could talk to you guys literally all day. That was just.
[01:09:05] Speaker B: Yeah, we really appreciate your time, guys. Again, you're so busy. But I think our listeners will love to hear that some people are just normal people, even though they do extraordinary things, which is what we try to do.
[01:09:17] Speaker D: Yeah.
[01:09:17] Speaker B: And they do it together, which is really cool.
[01:09:19] Speaker A: There's something so magical about sitting out on your farm and just looking across the paddock, just seeing the. Just seeing nature. It's just a joy. And your place is so, so inspiring because I think it's what people in their soul feel most at ease and most at peace at in life is obviously in nature. And as you say, the evidence supports it. And yeah, you're. I'm not going to copy your house, but I am going to copy the principles because it is so.
[01:09:49] Speaker D: It's the feeling.
[01:09:50] Speaker A: I want to copy it. Do you know what I mean?
[01:09:52] Speaker B: That's what people want. Because maybe they don't want your exact house, but they want. I want the feeling they give me when I look inside the house, when I see the fire pit out the front, when I see all that. They want that feeling because they want that in their lives. But I love how you're teaching them about their actual why and how and how they're going to get there. So they're not just getting your feeling, they're getting the feeling that they really want.
You're amazing. You've just spent quality time on your relationship.
[01:10:22] Speaker A: Feel like you're on a roll. If you want more living the team life relationship insights and conversations, head over to kimandroj.com, where you can find all the show notes as well as tons of other relationship goodies.
[01:10:32] Speaker B: And if you liked today's episode, please hit subscribe or let another couple know where they can find us. It'll make them happy, and it'll make us really happy.
[01:10:40] Speaker A: Until next time, keep on living the team life.
